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The Game

Get used to the Olympic protests

STEPHEN BRUNT

From Tuesday's Globe and Mail

Latest comment posted at 11:45 AM EDT 09/04/08

The problems dogging the torch's relay aren't about to disappear ...Read the full article

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  1. media hack from Canada writes: Remember Tiananmen Square? And the western outrage that led to more trade with China. Remember the Boycott of the Moscow Olympics following the Russian invasion of Afghanistan. And the western outrage that led to Taliban outrages in Afghanistan.
  2. Meng W. from Canada writes: Media hack: You do realize Canada is in Afghanistan today, fighting the exact same Taliban the Russians did... so maybe you should boycott Vancouver 2010 to keep up with the tradition?

    Honestly those Tibetan protester turned out to not be so good at PR. For starters, everyone's seen what prompted the Chinese crakcdown so you can't call them "innocent" or "peaceful". Secondly their violence in London and Paris (attacking children and people in wheelchairs) really isn't the best way to promot their cause.

    As the author pointed out, the sentence "remember [insert atrocity here]" is pretty much applicable to any country, the UK being no exception when 2012 comes. At the end of the day, when you look at the back of that "Free Tibet" sticker and see "Made in China", you'd know what really matters in the real world.
  3. Meng W. from Canada writes: I'm sorry if I seem to have mis-understood the original comment.
  4. RON BODEN from Sskatoon, Canada writes: It would have been insightful for Mr. Brunt to speculate on whether the animal rights activists/seal hunt protestors might decide to attack the Vancouver Winter Olympics with the same vitriol that the manipulators of the media are attacking ther Beijing Olympics and the flame journey.

    On the other side of the coin, is Stephen Harper sulking over the inattention Hu Jin Tao has paid him when Harper thinks he should get an audience? Too bad about Canada's rejection by the Chinese government as a prime vacation spot for Chinese. Too bad about the decline in our trade with China because some officials do not take the high road about affairs wthin the Chinese state, primarily reported on by the same people who are protesting China's actions.
  5. Bubbles McBubbles from Trawna, Canada writes: Stephen Brunt wrote: "They point out that past walkouts didn't accomplish much in the grand scheme of things — and they're almost 100-per-cent right about that, as could be said about most demonstrations and most issues."

    Right. Like Gandhi. He certainly wasn't very successful with all his crazy demonstrations. Or Nelson Mandela. Or Martin Luther King. Or the Berlin Wall demonstrators. Yeah. None of those guys succeeded by demonstrating. You are so right about that.

    But then there are the appeasers - like Neville Chamberlain. Oh yes. He was very successful, wasn't he. Giving those Fascists a free pass. So let's all make like Neville Chamberlain and ignore all the bad things going on in China today. Yes. Appeasement. Collaboration. Business as usual. That's the ticket. The PRC is bound to change if we continue with that strategy. Just like the IOC promised. Good thinking, Mr. Brunt. Comrade Meng W. thinks you are right on the money.
  6. Bubbles McBubbles from Trawna, Canada writes: Meng W. from Canada writes: "I'm sorry if I seem to have mis-understood the original comment."

    Yes, you shills better stick to the same committee approved talking points. Irony is not your strong suit.
  7. The Artist from Halifax, Canada writes: Ron Boden from Saskatoon, Canada:

    Please correct me if I am wrong, Ron, but are you actually comparing Tibetans to seals because it sure seems like you are...

    You just have to love the depths that the appeasers will stoop to to try to feel like they are doing the right thing by not protesting these Olympics...

    There will be further protests and demonstrations without question. Both the appeasers and the trolls of the PRC government (on this thread together) cannot stop this.

    Good for Harper for doing the right thing with respect to China...

    GWB/Dick Cheney would be proud of some of the commentators on this thread -- Accept evil if it's good for Canadian business and tourism, eh?
  8. Tyler S from Vancouver, Canada writes: The article's really biased.
    What can we say about these protests is that they are doing more harm than good to the Tibetans themselves. Really, as these protests turn out to be terribly violent, it changes my perspective of Tibetans.(thought they were peaceful)
  9. Melissa Wiebe from Canada writes: I listened to Mr. Brunt yesterday afternoon when he was on Prime Time Sports on the Fan 590 during a roundtable with Mike Toth and another sports writer and something was mentioned by Mr. Toth during the roundtable in that if Canada should boycott these games, China would only point out our country's treatment of our First Nations groups and also the treatment of the Japanese-Canadians during World War II, not that what our country did to the Japanese-Canadians during World War II nor to the First Nations should be compared to what we see and hear of what happens inside of China's borders. If I can recall correctly, there was mention of the fact that we are a country that has acknowledged what we have done and has apologized for its actions in the past. It was also brought up somewhere that the fact of England's own sordid past and its treatment of people during its period of colonization. And if Western nations do boycott, this will be brought up in the run up to the 2010 and 2012 games.

    But shame on GWB/Cheney for going to the opening ceremonies and basically saying that what the Chinese are doing in regards to human rights is correct, especially when the United States doesn't exactly have a great reputation at the present.
  10. William Scott Lee III from Vancouver, Canada writes: I think we have to be careful in how we label the Chinese government. I really get annoyed when people start using terms like totalitarian, fascist and communist dictatorship to describe the Chinese government. First because it is inaccurate, second because it does not help the debate. If Chinese was a totalitarian regime, they would use mustard gas on the Tibetans and we would be none the wiser.

    China is far more frightening then Nazi Germany or the former Soviet Union, because it is more like Imperial Germany prior to the First World War. Like Imperial Germany, China is authoritarian, nationalist, imperialist and capitalist. It is really sad that all the West seems to be concerned about when dealing with China is Tibet, and not concerned about Chinese influence in the developing world particularly in places like Latin America or Africa. In 15-20 years time, China will be both South America's and Africa largest trading partner. Basically the West is surrendering these parts of the world to Chinese influence because of complacence and/or neglect.
  11. smilin smiler from tbay, Canada writes: The best thing Canada can do is set an example for the world,
    [ perhaps in association with other countries ], is to withdraw our name, anthem, and flag from the games. Our athletes could still attend at our expense but they would compete as individual citizens of the world. This solution if adopted by other countries would neatly difuse the jingoistic horrors that attend the Olympics and would be a nice protest about human rights in China. We could continue this practice at future games even including Vancouver as an example of the unity of humanity and the divisiveness of national states. I guess we'd have to keep the team sports as national endeavours but any jingoism attached to them would show the divisiveness of nationalism as compared with our unity as human beings- reflected in the non-national individual sports.
  12. Matt Goulet from winnipeg, Canada writes: hey Tyler S: the protests are never violent until the chinese police are called in.
  13. smilin smiler from tbay, Canada writes: Also a shout out to William Scott Lee 111 for his comments. Great comparison. Imperial Germany really marked the start of so many horrors..... in the 20th C. I often try and imagine a world where the European powers had avoided WW1- would there be no nuke bombs/power, jet-aircraft, tanks, ied's, genocides, Communist states etc etc. I think you're right it behooves us to learn from history to see where the world is going. I was watching Lou Dobbs on CNN last nite ( till I found some jr hockey on cablecast) and he couldn't say China without prefacing the name with Communist. I guess China is officially Communist but it just shows the mind-lessness. I kept watching to see if he could say China without calling it Communist. The closest he came was by using Beijing as an alternative.
  14. don cherry from toronto, writes: Boycott Tibet

    Free the Olympics
  15. George Hall from Canada writes: For the Chinese ambassador to Canada to call the Dalai Llama a liar demonstrates how brainwashed the Chinese bureacrats are. the Chinese are to be automatons without feeling in a heartl and soulless Communist regime.
    These games should be called off as should have the 1936 German games under Adolph Hitler.......The Games are being used by the Chinese to legitamize their oppression and their genocide of the Tibetan people.
    Any company that sponsors the games should be boycotted for sure.
  16. George Hall from Canada writes: It should mean nothing the George Bush and Dick Cheney support the games as these perverts lied to the entire world about weapons of mass destruction which has led to the death and destruction of millions...all the wile their company Haliburton makes billions on the war.
    Bush and Cheney have and deserve no credibility whatsoever.
  17. The Business from Canada writes: Note also that the argument the apologists for the Chinese government are making amounts to, "Well, you did x in the past, so therefore we can do whatever we want in Tibet now."

    Note the complete lack of moral leadership in that argument. Note that it uses the past to justify what happens now and in the future. For theses apologists nothing has happened in the West for over 200 years.

    Asking oneself 'where would I rather live, the West or China?' should raise the obvious point that the progress the West has made on equality for all, lack of oppression, open-ness, safety and general stability we offer to immigrants from across the planet makes this the place to live. Not to mention the the amends we've made for past mistakes.

    Folks, one of the posters above has it precisely right: let's not make like Neville Chamberlain and other appeasers. We're right on the issues China inflicts on its people and in Tibet. Keep standing for what is right and don't back down.

    The apologists must make a positive argument for China and the Olympics. "You did it 200 years ago so it's ok for us now" isn't an argument anyone anywhere should accept for killing, oppression and expansionist behaviour.
  18. The Business from Canada writes: William,

    That is one of the more curious postings about China I have read. Not to label China as Communist and totalitarian is flat out wrong. By some estimates, 70 million people perished under Mao's Communist Party. The same party, by the way, that governs today.

    I'm sure it wasn't your intention to diminish the suffering the Chinese have experienced under Communism and its ruthlessly totalitarian behaviour. While they have made moves toward liberalizing their economy, they are still officially communist in economics, and very much totalitarian in behaviour. The fact they haven't gassed the Tibetans does not amount to evidence that they are somehow merely imperialist.

    While it's a hell of a long read, "Mao, The Untold Story" is incredibly illuminating. The sheer depth of suffering in China rivals and in some ways even exceeds that of Communist Russia and Nazi Germany. The fact that put a pretty face on some of their actions should not distract us from the reality of the situation.

    http://www.amazon.com/Mao-Story-Jung-Chang/dp/0679422714
  19. Dogman Smith from Halifax, Canada writes: The Olympics should be a "go" for all nations. So should the protests continue. Let the athletes have their day. Issues such as Tibet and human rights in China (and the USA and Canada and Russia and Chechnya and South Africa and Sierra Leone and the Ivory Coast and Liberia and Afghanistan and Pakistan etc, etc) will have to be resolved outside of the Olympic context. Protest as u will. It is valid and valuable but a boycott will solve nothing!!!
  20. John Bladen from Canada writes: I think some posters are missing the point here... no-one is arguing that China isn't using the games for political purpose. The issue Mr. Brunt appears to have been trying to illustrate is that the IOC awarded the games to China knowing this would happen (as it did in Moscow in 1980, Los Angeles in 1984 et al).

    Yes, Dr. King and Gandhi had success... but we are not talking about large scale grassroots public disobedience (civil or otherwise). We are talking about the Olympics... and based on past history, can anyone honestly say the boycotts of Moscow in 1980 or Los Angeles in 1984 did anything at all to further social causes (anywhere)? In fact, wasn't their only achievement to punish athletes training for these games?

    We can talk at length about whether Canada should go (to any Olympics, not just this one) given the highly political nature of the competition, the drug scandals (just once I'd like to see a nation refuse to attend on the grounds that the competition isn't "level" because of the failed drug testing system... ), or the negative financial effects of the games on host nations (ask Montreallers and the good people of Greece about the 'real cost' of the Olympics). If the goal is to "punish" China for it's political system or it's international behaviour, I would suggest to you that we might be 50 years too late in starting. Is this argument about the plight of Tibetans or dislike of China? Is it about working for change within China or just publicly humiliating some of the Chinese officials? There are very few singular causes in the world, and I doubt this is one of them.

    We boycotted Moscow over the USSR in Afghanistan. We may boycott China over their actions in Tibet. In this newfound zeal for social justice, let no-one forget we are now in Afghanistan... and then let's hustle off to the big box store for some cheap imported shoes...
  21. Cindy Luk from HK, Hong Kong writes: 20 innocent bystanders have already been killed by some rioters, what's the magic number of dead Han and Hui Muslims that might make calling in the police legitimate?

    While we are at it, since when is burning down Mosques an acceptable protest against lack of religious freedom and other HR abuse?

    As for the Olympics being targeted, I think it's just fair game. But"brutal crackdown on peaceful demonstrators" is a grave accusation. Are you sure that it was peaceful? Have you check out eye-witness footages and testimonies from journalist (Yes, there is one and he gave an interview on CNN) and independent travelers (loads of these, many of them Canadians)? Were the police called in b4 or after the riots? Did they witness any police brutality in Lhasa?

    Radio France Internationale released an interview on April 2
    (http://www.rfi.fr/actucn/articles/100/article_6734 ...

    The reporter asked Dawa Tsering, spokesman for Tibet's Gov. in Exile, why hadn't he condemn the savage killings of Han Chinese by Tibetan rioters.

    Mr Tsering answered: "First of all, I have to declare that during the whole event Tibetans did not take any violent actions. From the view of Tibetans, violence means hurt to a person's life. From the videos we can see, there were beatings on Han Chinese. But those were only beatings. After beating, those Han Chinese would run away. That's just beating, not a hurt to human life. All those being killed are just because of accidents, which can be clearly observed in the news from CCP. They would hiding upstairs when Tibetans smashed the doors. They were just hiding and did not run away when Tibetans set the fire. They were burnt to death by accident. Those who set the fire did not know there were Han Chinese hiding upstairs."

    Folks, ru protesting to support these "non-violent" people?

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